Indie Music Ecosystem
I’ve been pondering some ideas since a Mastodon post by @meljoann spawned a discussion with a lot of energy as to how all of the listeners, music-makers and platform owners in the (specifically Fedi) indie music space can better support and promote one another.
Naturally lots of people have lots of ideas and there had been good attempts to get some of these down via conversation rooms, group documents etc. until Christmas (and perhaps a general feeling of downbeat from the sunsetting of Radio Free Fedi) seemed to stem the tide.
Then earlier this week @keefmarshall posted an excellent article on his excitement and hope for the future, based on the first steps of interoperability between Bandwagon and The Indie Beat Radio (TIBR).
(Platforms developed by @benpate and @mizkirsten respectively – two people that I know, having spoken directly with them, are building the things they’re building for all of the right reasons).
Keef’s article has got conversation flowing again and it’s at this point I want to share some of the notes I’ve made. I was going to write it in article format but was finding it hard to find a coherent structure to put many interlinking thoughts together. So instead I’ve scribbled down some stuff on this whiteboard.
TLDR; If we can develop the ecosystem which envelopes all of the platforms that currently support indie artists, bringing along all of the good things that Pitchfork, Bandcamp and Spotify combined* did (discovery, distribution (inc. attribution), fair artist payment, consent and trust (Thanks Keef for articulating these labels in your post!)) then I think we could be on to something. Interoperability and community are key to making that work.
*Pitchfork-wise: Quality reviews people enjoy reading and feel they can trust.
Bandcamp-wise: Radio discoverability, access to previews, full purchases, catalogues, fair artist payment etc.
Spotify-wise: Standalone player and ability to create playlists and now-playing queues.
My whiteboard isn’t comprehensive (I’m sure I’ve missed out a lot of initiatives that should be included, apologies!) It’s just down as an illustration of my understanding of things at present. My hope is that it helps develop further progression.
I’ll sign off by saying I share Keef’s optimism and I too feel excited by the prospect of what lies ahead. There’s a lot of work to be done and there will be quite a few technical issues to solve but where there’s a will (and I see a lot of will in this community) there’s a way (and there is a ******* way!)
Sam
It's great to see so much energy in this space right now. Thank you for posting this. You all are awesome.
I want to align all/many/most of these ideas into our existing roadmap. It's all doable, and I think we're already pretty close.
I'm hoping to get caught up over this weekend. When I am, I'll try to post a long-form reply, because all these ideas are so much bigger than the 500 characters Mastodon gives me 🙂
@mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @mizkirsten
@benpate @mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @mizkirsten I just want to say that I'm 100% on board with this conversation, and I'm in agreement with pretty much everything that I've seen.
A little piece that I'd like to add: I think musicians who choose not to participate in the musical economy should be considered as seriously as those who do. Meaning, just because I choose not to charge money for my music does not mean that I'm "devaluing" it. There are other ways to value art.
@benpate @mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @mizkirsten Like the other posters in this thread, this is something I need to flesh out in longer form writing, but just throwing it down here as an idea.
100% yes. Money is awesome. I love money. But it’s not validation.
Can you suggest anything that I can do from a technical standpoint to help reinforce this?
@alisynthesis @mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @mizkirsten
@benpate @mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @mizkirsten That's a great question. Let me think on it.
Related question: are bandcamp supporters only people who have purchased a track or an album, or are they people who have downloaded it if it's offered for free? If the latter, I think that's a pretty positive move that puts the decision in the musician's hands as to what constitutes "support" for them.
great question, and one I can’t answer. I’m spending very little time in Bandcamp, these days.
But it’s an excellent point – allow people to express their support and interest in an artist or album in a way that has nothing to do with paying money.
I’ll try to figure out how we do this.
@alisynthesis @mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @mizkirsten
@benpate @alisynthesis @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten
on the Fediverse, support could be a like or a boost…
@keefmarshall @benpate @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten totally. The game really changes when things are integrated by activitypub.
@keefmarshall @benpate @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten I guess the way I feel most supported personally is when someone says something meaningful about something I've made. It's so easy to feel like we're making things that don't connect to other human beings and proof that that's not true feels absolutely amazing and gives me a lot of inspiration to keep creating things.
This is the only reason I put things on YouTube: because I do get some of that feedback from people.
@keefmarshall @benpate @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten I think that an interconnected system that allows people to comment on artists and albums and tracks as a part of their own online identity would be pretty amazing.
So I'm listening to a track. I'm loving it, and I can immediately say something about it that's posted to my own mastodon timeline, and of course, links back to the thing I'm talking about.
To me, this is the promise of the Fediverse.
@keefmarshall @benpate @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten Continuing my ramble about this, what I love about it is that it makes the musician/listener relationship a two-way street. My appreciation for someone else becomes part of my own writing, the feed under my name. Up till now, pretty much all online platforms have kept that relationship pretty one-sided.
@alisynthesis @keefmarshall @benpate @mixtape @meljoann
Yessss to all this discussion! 👏
@alisynthesis @keefmarshall @benpate @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten
We agree 100%! Any thoughtful comment on music that was made with heart and soul is worth so much more than any streaming numbers anywhere. Knowing that our music touched somebody somewhere is so meaningful to artists. And for fans, it's so much fun to geek out about their favorite music!
Yes. So much better than clicking a little star or heart.
I’ve heard the exact same thing from the graphic artist world, too.
Clearly we can do better than simply copying Xitter’s for-profit engagement machine.
@alisynthesis @keefmarshall @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten
@benpate @keefmarshall @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten we absolutely can! ❤️
Yes. So for albums it’s pretty straightforward. Show “likes” publicly. Lots of platforms do this.
For artist profiles, it’s a bit trickier. We (kinda) use “follows” for this, but it’s not an exact match. We might just try this as a proxy, but I feel like there’s a better solution.
The wider Fediverse needs this, anyway. Can I “endorse” someone separate from following them? It opens up lots of possibilities.
@keefmarshall @alisynthesis @mixtape @meljoann @mizkirsten
@mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @benpate
"and there is a ******* way!" I see what you did there 🤩
The whiteboard is amazing! Thank you so much for doing that work.
One thing I think is a key piece of audience/discovery is sharing. I discover a lot of my favorite artists because someone I know and like tells me about them. And there are a lot of audience members who take a great deal of pride in introducing others to underground/indie artists.
@mixtape
Yes to all of this. Love the whiteboard, Sam!
@mixtape your whiteboard is fantastic Sam ! 👏👏👏
@meljoann @keefmarshall @benpate @mizkirsten
@mixtape @meljoann @keefmarshall @benpate @mizkirsten love these ideas. Need to favorite this so I can come back to read it all when I have time 😃